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Legality of Unique Stepchart AAA's

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Post #1 · Posted at 2017-10-12 06:08:52pm 2.1 months ago

Offline Cowtao
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Last updated: 2017-10-12 06:14pm
Sup. Wanted to make a thread because this rule hasn't been discussed or have been shown in a manner that is known. There are songs within DDR that have various edits or different step charts. Some of these changes are miniscual with sync edits, some of these are small step chart edits for syncing reasons. I want to bring in discussion of what it means to AAA them and what to know if these apply as different or the same type of AAA.

Songs with Stepchart Edits
This includes the various edits made from ULTRAMIX -> FESTIVAL. Most of these charts would see another change in SUPERNOVA. Another notable example is Stomp To My Beat's DDRMAX USA's Chart. It is missing one note in the expert chart and it uses the 2ndMIX Era chart. Would this constitute a new AAA and would it be legal to make an edit chart using the chart from another game and counting that as another AAA?

Songs with Manual Sync Fixes
This is a smaller category but there are a few Boss songs that were notably tweaked due to questionable syncing. A notable example of this would be NGO. It had notoriously bad sync in SUPERNOVA 2 but was tweaked in A. Would the older sync of Supernova 2 count as a new AAA or would both be considered the same AAA.

Glitch Stepcharts
This is revolving entirely around the DDR EXTREME course glitch. For those that do not know, it is glitch where if you select a course too early and the game doesn't register which course you are on, it will give you a different step chart then the usual chart the game is supposed to give you. DAM DARRIRAM, Love Shine, and Last Message have this error. Do these count as completely unique AAA's or do they not count?

Using Edit Mode
This one is a little bit more accepted as not, but this is still a valid concern. The use of edit mode to create other charts of the same song used in other games where it has a different chart. Should this be considered a legal way of getting another AAA? There are constraints to those as there were several new Challenge Charts made for DDR X3 vs 2ndMIX. Making an edit in a game where it's grade system doesn't match X3's might be a constraint to this being okay. There are also the another edits made in CLUB VERSION that had only a handful of the another's song cuts make it to another game. (Notably PARANOiA MAX ~Dirty Mix~ (ANOTHER VERSION 2) made it onto DDRMAX US) Would it be perfectly fine to make a step chart using a similar song with the same song length using the other game's Stepchart and could that as a AAA?

I know there are probably more things I am missing at this time, but I want this to be a constructive discussion of if these types of changes are okay to consider it another AAA to add in to a person's log.
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Post #2 · Posted at 2017-10-12 06:17:10pm 2.1 months ago

Offline rapidemboar
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As someone who's never AAA'd a song before, I don't have much I can add to this. I think changing the sync of individual steps changes the legality, though. bag's Heavy and Challenge charts are the same, except Challenge uses the old, slightly off-sync steps, and they're scored separately. That's all I can judge it on...

Post #3 · Posted at 2017-10-12 06:51:50pm 2.1 months ago

Offline Harman Smith
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Glitch Stepcharts
This is revolving entirely around the DDR EXTREME course glitch. For those that do not know, it is glitch where if you select a course too early and the game doesn't register which course you are on, it will give you a different step chart then the usual chart the game is supposed to give you. DAM DARRIRAM, Love Shine, and Last Message have this error. Do these count as completely unique AAA's or do they not count?

No. It's impossible to play these charts on their own, or even outside of Challenge Mode.

Post #4 · Posted at 2017-10-12 09:16:31pm 2.1 months ago

Offline 3x3qui3l
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"Ice Bear believed in you."
Quote: Cowtao
Glitch Stepcharts
This is revolving entirely around the DDR EXTREME course glitch. For those that do not know, it is glitch where if you select a course too early and the game doesn't register which course you are on, it will give you a different step chart then the usual chart the game is supposed to give you. DAM DARRIRAM, Love Shine, and Last Message have this error. Do these count as completely unique AAA's or do they not count?

I highly doubt these count, since they aren't accesible by normal methods. Not to mention two of those charts are unfinished (Last Message's chart has no arrows until the end of the chorus, while HIGHER's consists only of left arrows).
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Post #5 · Posted at 2017-10-18 05:11:09pm 1.9 months ago

Offline rayword45
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Last updated: 2017-10-18 05:11pm
Quote: Cowtao
Songs with Stepchart Edits
This includes the various edits made from ULTRAMIX -> FESTIVAL. Most of these charts would see another change in SUPERNOVA. Another notable example is Stomp To My Beat's DDRMAX USA's Chart. It is missing one note in the expert chart and it uses the 2ndMIX Era chart. Would this constitute a new AAA and would it be legal to make an edit chart using the chart from another game and counting that as another AAA?

Songs with Manual Sync Fixes
This is a smaller category but there are a few Boss songs that were notably tweaked due to questionable syncing. A notable example of this would be NGO. It had notoriously bad sync in SUPERNOVA 2 but was tweaked in A. Would the older sync of Supernova 2 count as a new AAA or would both be considered the same AAA.

Glitch Stepcharts
This is revolving entirely around the DDR EXTREME course glitch. For those that do not know, it is glitch where if you select a course too early and the game doesn't register which course you are on, it will give you a different step chart then the usual chart the game is supposed to give you. DAM DARRIRAM, Love Shine, and Last Message have this error. Do these count as completely unique AAA's or do they not count?

Using Edit Mode
This one is a little bit more accepted as not, but this is still a valid concern. The use of edit mode to create other charts of the same song used in other games where it has a different chart. Should this be considered a legal way of getting another AAA? There are constraints to those as there were several new Challenge Charts made for DDR X3 vs 2ndMIX. Making an edit in a game where it's grade system doesn't match X3's might be a constraint to this being okay. There are also the another edits made in CLUB VERSION that had only a handful of the another's song cuts make it to another game. (Notably PARANOiA MAX ~Dirty Mix~ (ANOTHER VERSION 2) made it onto DDRMAX US) Would it be perfectly fine to make a step chart using a similar song with the same song length using the other game's Stepchart and could that as a AAA?

I know there are probably more things I am missing at this time, but I want this to be a constructive discussion of if these types of changes are okay to consider it another AAA to add in to a person's log.

1. I don't know what you mean by count, but if you have two separate official AAAs they should both be logged. Stuff done on an edit file will never count because edit.
2. This is one AAA = one AAA because it's the same damn chart and a load of DDR basically requires you to memorize how offsync it is anyways.

Wait, NGO was FIXED in A?! That shit still felt like garbage.

3. These will never count on a database but I mean if you upload that to a website props
4. I'm just gonna make a bunch of 1 note charts

Post #6 · Posted at 2017-11-10 02:54:34pm 1.1 months ago

Offline KittyBox
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How I see a AAA as being the same as another AAA is as follows:
1. If a chart has different timing, it's a different AAA. (See bag Challenge, an official implementation of this.)
2. Edits should be considered the same chart as long as no mistakes were made in the conversion.
3. If the versions being compared have a different grading system, it's still the same AAA if it meets the requirements on both games.
4. CS versions have a bigger perfect window, so any edits to recreate arcade charts must either be played on EXTREME AC or MFC'd.
4a. Mods for CS versions to use AC timing windows might be the same AAA, but the nature of such mods would make it questionable.
5. Playing a CS chart on AC EXTREME and getting a AAA on it is the same since on either machine it'd be a AAA.
6. Playing an ANOTHER VER. chart on the regular version of the song is the same AAA as long as the BPMs and stuff are the same.
7. Glitch charts are legitimate, unique AAA's. If someone discovers a glitch that results in a different chart each time though, it's invalid.

It seems strange to me if edits are inherently illegitimate despite following the above rules since the basic gameplay and timing doesn't differ under these circumstances. How I see it, there's nothing different unless there's something I missed, which really could just be tacked on as a rule 8 or something if need be.
I've never gotten a AAA so my opinion might not be as valuable as some others, but I think it'd be good for the community to make a conclusion more in-depth than "Edit AAA's aren't real AAA's because yes."
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