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How to improve on pad/arcade?

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Post #1 · Posted at 2014-02-23 03:32:17am 11.3 years ago

Offline TheDarkness
TheDarkness Avatar Member
17 Posts
United States
Reg. 2014-02-23

Nintendo Network ID: Alex3113603DS Friend Code: 1865-0112-3336
"busy killing a keyboard"
I really like playing DDR, however the only way I can play is at the arcade. I go ther ea lot, but I'm kinda sucky because I can only play Standard and Light. And If I DO play Heavy, it's on probably the easiest song (which is terrible).

My question is: What's a easy way to improve stamina on this? I'd try to eat better and exercise more, but that's probably not enough. I'd need to increase footspeed and move faster.

Either way, let me know, as I'd really love to do better on DDR and games similar.
Very Happy
just some guy that plays games lol why do you care

Post #2 · Posted at 2014-02-23 04:02:00am 11.3 years ago

Offline BemaniHyper
BemaniHyper Avatar Member+
1,435 Posts
United States
Reg. 2013-09-13

If you really want to get fast and have a lot of stamina, you just need to play as much as you can. If you're really serious about the game, there are metal pads like the Omega ITGX or the DDRGame line of metal pads. Also, there are 2 options for playing at home: get a PS2 if you don't have one so you can play PS2 DDR games, or get this adapter so you can use any PS2 pad with Stepmania. That's all I can really say about it; hope it helps to some extent.

Post #3 · Posted at 2014-02-23 04:07:41am 11.3 years ago

Offline Adamn
Adamn Avatar Member
187 Posts
United States
Reg. 2007-09-06


Last updated: 2014-02-23 04:09am
Keep playing, and don't get discouraged.

- Improving your diet can and will help both the short-term and long-term, and you will just feel better. You should do this anyway!
- There is no "easy" way to improve stamina. But a repeatable method would be to find a song that makes you tired, but is passable, and pick something a little bit harder than that. Play this song as your last stage, so you don't fail your other songs! Give it your all!
- DDR is a challenge between you and the machine. Don't let someone who can AAA hard songs discourage you; let them inspire you.
- That being said, watch a local who can pass heavy songs while they play, and try to absorb some of the concepts. "Doublestepping" vs "Pivoting", "Flat foot" versus "on your toe," etc. Experiment with them all, as there are top players that do each.
- Avoid using the bar when building your stamina - it will require less energy to hit all of the arrows, and you will not improve all that much.

Once you get into the heavy range (SuperNova2 and before, 8's and up, X and up, 11's and up), you will find techniques that can be polished to help you minimize energy used while playing. But don't worry about them so much now.

Post #4 · Posted at 2014-02-25 02:22:56am 11.3 years ago

Offline Mad Matt
Mad Matt Avatar Member
65 Posts
United States
Reg. 2011-10-26

Quote: Adamn
- Avoid using the bar when building your stamina - it will require less energy to hit all of the arrows, and you will not improve all that much.
I disagree.

Post #5 · Posted at 2014-02-25 02:34:58am 11.3 years ago

Offline no dice
no dice Avatar Member
107 Posts
United States
Reg. 2013-10-15

"Don't get depressed!"
This is going to sound stupid, but thinking positive helps a lot. Obviously, you won't be able to do things outside of your skill range magically by thinking positive, but it will help you play better, and when you see yourself doing better, it's just that much more motivation to keep going.

Post #6 · Posted at 2014-02-25 03:42:30am 11.3 years ago

Offline Adamn
Adamn Avatar Member
187 Posts
United States
Reg. 2007-09-06

Quote: Mad Matt
Quote: Adamn
- Avoid using the bar when building your stamina - it will require less energy to hit all of the arrows, and you will not improve all that much.
I disagree.

Understood. My logic is predicated on the intent to improve stamina - I could have been more clear. Using the bar reduces energy spent playing, and as such, will improve your stamina less while likely improving scores. However, everything is relative - if you can pass 13s without the bar and can pass 15s with and get more tired, it may actually help. I'm talking purely at the "breaking into heavy songs" level.

Post #7 · Posted at 2014-02-25 04:12:08am 11.3 years ago

Offline no dice
no dice Avatar Member
107 Posts
United States
Reg. 2013-10-15

"Don't get depressed!"
In my experience, using the bar has not interfered with making progress as a player. As long as you're pushing yourself to reach new goals, you can still make steady improvements.

I'd say it's up to the individual which way they prefer to play. I've tried training with no bar before and I didn't feel any significant advantage over training while using the bar. I always just felt like I was wasting energy.

Post #8 · Posted at 2014-02-25 08:49:22am 11.3 years ago

Offline warpdr!ve
warpdr!ve Avatar Member
339 Posts
United States
Reg. 2011-09-15

"Fairy-nough"
Increasing footspeed is kind of tough without playing because the kind of motions you need for footspeed doesn't translate well to other activities.

The best way is to play easier songs at faster speeds, such as picking a 200+ bpm Standard song instead of a slower Heavy one, for example.

If you post what songs are the hardest you can pass right now I'd be able to be more specific with the last point.
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Post #9 · Posted at 2014-02-25 09:54:22am 11.3 years ago

Offline NuVirus
NuVirus Avatar Member
694 Posts
United States
Reg. 2011-10-10

What are some of the hardest charts you have passed to date on DDR?
"I never really got better, I just learned to accept that some people aren't meant to be happy in this world. It makes it easier when you're not hoping for something that will never come." -IndependentThinker2

Post #10 · Posted at 2014-02-25 02:00:53pm 11.3 years ago

Offline Zeth
Zeth Avatar Member
9 Posts
United States
Reg. 2012-02-22

Stamina is improved basically by playing for as long as you can. When I was playing to improve my stamina, I just picked charts that had a lot of replayability and played them over and over until I was absolutely exhausted. If you just play a round and then rest, you won't build up stamina. Stamina improves when you push yourself as far as you can go, and do that over and over until your body says "Okay, I've gotten used to this." and it begins to take longer and longer to get tired. That's how it's worked for me, anyway.

Footspeed is a bit more tricky to improve. Depending on your skill level, foot speed is either crucial to beating certain songs, or not very important at all. If you're sticking to mostly Standard difficulty and occasionally trying Heavy, I wouldn't worry about footspeed too much. Instead, consider how efficiently you move. That is, how much do you move your feet to hit an arrow? I see many players around your skill level who move their feet an unbelievable amount, and it slows them down and uses far more energy. Everybody has a comfortable stance they develop, and I'm not going to push my preferences on you, but try look at how much you move and see if you can get used to accomplishing the same steps while moving your feet a shorter distance. For example, you don't have to step on the center of a panel every time, try stepping closer to the inside edge.

There's probably many more things that can be done to help you out, but these are a couple things I think you should start looking at if you want to improve your play.

Best of luck!

Post #11 · Posted at 2014-02-25 11:38:02pm 11.3 years ago

Offline ranatalus
ranatalus Avatar Member
84 Posts
United States
Reg. 2007-12-12

Game Center Nickname: ranatalus
"hurrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr"
Yeah, I agree with Adamn; when you're at your stage of trying to build stamina, avoid using the bar. It can help a lot later, but at this stage it is just likely to make you plateau sooner. When I was building stamina, I would play back to back sets until I felt I couldn't play anymore, and then would force myself through 1 more round. Even though my score in that last round would be atrocious, it definitely built stamina.

Post #12 · Posted at 2014-02-27 05:14:50am 11.3 years ago

Offline Cardia
Cardia Avatar Member
2,925 Posts
United States
Reg. 2009-04-08

Nintendo Switch Friend Code: SW-5116-3740-7232
Quote: no dice
This is going to sound stupid, but thinking positive helps a lot. Obviously, you won't be able to do things outside of your skill range magically by thinking positive, but it will help you play better, and when you see yourself doing better, it's just that much more motivation to keep going.

This is actually a huge one. I quit DDR for a while in spring 2005 (I was 11 at the time), and then started back up in January 2007. And like most awkward 13 year olds, this was my "angsty teenager phase", so I was extremely pessimistic about everything. I'd constantly be like "ugh I suck at this game I'm totally not ever going to get better ugh why do I even bother ugh". It even got to the point where I would occasionally have some random freakouts on DDR Freak and lash out at people just because they were better at the game, with the typical pity party woe-is-me kind of shit mixed in.But I can't always be pessimistic about everything, so instead of constantly putting myself down, I tried saying to myself "you're not the greatest at the game, but you don't have to be. Keep going", tried some new techniques (flat footing, better posture, moderating bar usage) and I started to see significant improvements pretty quickly. I'm still learning new things now, all these years later.

To expand on the flat footing thing a bit, one thing to keep an eye out for is consistency. You might not have to worry about it that much on higher end Standard songs or low Heavy songs, but as you go higher and higher, you do need to make sure that you're keep your foot flat. On fast 9 foot songs like Drop Out or 10's such as Max 300 or Paranoia Survivor, you might unconsciously switch back to playing on your toes during faster parts. DON'T do this. Do everything you can to kick this habit. If you do it enough, eventually your feet will stop doing it. This is vital to getting better scores on harder songs.

To be fair, it's not going to work for everyone, so if you're able to get decent scores using your own methods, go for it. There are plenty of players who can still get great scores using the more typical playing style of using your toes.

Post #13 · Posted at 2014-02-27 05:54:23am 11.3 years ago

Offline TheDarkness
TheDarkness Avatar Member
17 Posts
United States
Reg. 2014-02-23

Nintendo Network ID: Alex3113603DS Friend Code: 1865-0112-3336
"busy killing a keyboard"
Thanks for the help, guys! I'll begin to quote each one of you.

Quote: PinkiePieGamer
If you really want to get fast and have a lot of stamina, you just need to play as much as you can. If you're really serious about the game, there are metal pads like the Omega ITGX or the DDRGame line of metal pads. Also, there are 2 options for playing at home: get a PS2 if you don't have one so you can play PS2 DDR games, or get this adapter so you can use any PS2 pad with Stepmania. That's all I can really say about it; hope it helps to some extent.

This would be really, REALLY great...but I live in an apartment on the top floor, so....yeah.

Quote: Adamn
Keep playing, and don't get discouraged.
Very true. I try to when I can, but most of the time I really can't.

Quote: Adamn
- Improving your diet can and will help both the short-term and long-term, and you will just feel better. You should do this anyway!

What are some good suggestions? Most of the time I eat really unhealthy crap like Totino's Pizzas and other things. I'm not exactly "food smart". >_>

Quote: Adamn
- There is no "easy" way to improve stamina. But a repeatable method would be to find a song that makes you tired, but is passable, and pick something a little bit harder than that. Play this song as your last stage, so you don't fail your other songs! Give it your all!

That's a really good idea! I usually just start slow on easy Standard songs, then gradually pick harder ones.

Quote: Adamn
- DDR is a challenge between you and the machine. Don't let someone who can AAA hard songs discourage you; let them inspire you.

They really don't discourage me, it actually really, REALLY enspires me. Players like Mad Matt, DrDvids, RIN-GO! and a lot of other people really show that even the hardest things can still be achieved.

Quote: Adamn
- That being said, watch a local who can pass heavy songs while they play, and try to absorb some of the concepts. "Doublestepping" vs "Pivoting", "Flat foot" versus "on your toe," etc. Experiment with them all, as there are top players that do each.

I wish there were locals. The Tee Time in my area has a ITG 2 Machine, and the Swing A Round Fun Town has a DDR Extreme. I don't see much pros/locals though. Just kids stomping on the panels randomly. :/

Quote: Adamn
- Avoid using the bar when building your stamina - it will require less energy to hit all of the arrows, and you will not improve all that much.

I have to agree with Mad Matt on this one, plain saying:

Quote: Mad Matt
I disagree.

I've played with the bar a LOT, and I don't really feel drained of energy after my first credit. Although on some songs I do start sweating.

Quote: Adamn
Once you get into the heavy range (SuperNova2 and before, 8's and up, X and up, 11's and up), you will find techniques that can be polished to help you minimize energy used while playing. But don't worry about them so much now.

What techniques would be good for me later on exactly? Toe tapping seems good because you can move around a bit easier, but it seems like it could tire me out.

Quote: no dice
This is going to sound stupid, but thinking positive helps a lot. Obviously, you won't be able to do things outside of your skill range magically by thinking positive, but it will help you play better, and when you see yourself doing better, it's just that much more motivation to keep going.

I do this a lot. I'm not discouraged so easily when I fail a hard song.

Quote: warpdr!ve
Increasing footspeed is kind of tough without playing because the kind of motions you need for footspeed doesn't translate well to other activities.

The best way is to play easier songs at faster speeds, such as picking a 200+ bpm Standard song instead of a slower Heavy one, for example.

If you post what songs are the hardest you can pass right now I'd be able to be more specific with the last point.

This seems useful. It's like saying: Play Paranoia Survivor on Standard instead of playing Silent Hill on Heavy (or the challenge one, Silent Hill 3rd Christmas Mix in case you unlock that one).

Off-Topic: I love your ITG FG simfiles. Just love them.

Quote: NuVirus
What are some of the hardest charts you have passed to date on DDR?

That's VERY hard to remember. I'd have to go back to the arcade and play some again and post scores.

Quote: Zeth
Stamina is improved basically by playing for as long as you can. When I was playing to improve my stamina, I just picked charts that had a lot of replayability and played them over and over until I was absolutely exhausted. If you just play a round and then rest, you won't build up stamina. Stamina improves when you push yourself as far as you can go, and do that over and over until your body says "Okay, I've gotten used to this." and it begins to take longer and longer to get tired. That's how it's worked for me, anyway.

Footspeed is a bit more tricky to improve. Depending on your skill level, foot speed is either crucial to beating certain songs, or not very important at all. If you're sticking to mostly Standard difficulty and occasionally trying Heavy, I wouldn't worry about footspeed too much. Instead, consider how efficiently you move. That is, how much do you move your feet to hit an arrow? I see many players around your skill level who move their feet an unbelievable amount, and it slows them down and uses far more energy. Everybody has a comfortable stance they develop, and I'm not going to push my preferences on you, but try look at how much you move and see if you can get used to accomplishing the same steps while moving your feet a shorter distance. For example, you don't have to step on the center of a panel every time, try stepping closer to the inside edge.

There's probably many more things that can be done to help you out, but these are a couple things I think you should start looking at if you want to improve your play.

Best of luck!

Thanks for the information! I'll try some of these things when I can!

Quote: PureBlue
This is actually a huge one. I quit DDR for a while in spring 2005 (I was 11 at the time), and then started back up in January 2007. And like most awkward 13 year olds, this was my "angsty teenager phase", so I was extremely pessimistic about everything. I'd constantly be like "ugh I suck at this game I'm totally not ever going to get better ugh why do I even bother ugh". It even got to the point where I would occasionally have some random freakouts on DDR Freak and lash out at people just because they were better at the game, with the typical pity party woe-is-me kind of shit mixed in.But I can't always be pessimistic about everything, so instead of constantly putting myself down, I tried saying to myself "you're not the greatest at the game, but you don't have to be. Keep going", tried some new techniques (flat footing, better posture, moderating bar usage) and I started to see significant improvements pretty quickly. I'm still learning new things now, all these years later.

To expand on the flat footing thing a bit, one thing to keep an eye out for is consistency. You might not have to worry about it that much on higher end Standard songs or low Heavy songs, but as you go higher and higher, you do need to make sure that you're keep your foot flat. On fast 9 foot songs like Drop Out or 10's such as Max 300 or Paranoia Survivor, you might unconsciously switch back to playing on your toes during faster parts. DON'T do this. Do everything you can to kick this habit. If you do it enough, eventually your feet will stop doing it. This is vital to getting better scores on harder songs.

To be fair, it's not going to work for everyone, so if you're able to get decent scores using your own methods, go for it. There are plenty of players who can still get great scores using the more typical playing style of using your toes.

Again, thanks for more information! And trust me, I've had that same experience as a teenager before. trust me. it wasn't fun.

Either way, thanks for all the tips, tricks, and info guys! I'll keep posting here often when I find something useful.
just some guy that plays games lol why do you care

Post #14 · Posted at 2014-03-10 10:16:05am 11.3 years ago

Offline AkihiroIIDX
AkihiroIIDX Avatar Member+
198 Posts
France
Reg. 2012-05-21

Nintendo Network ID: Akihiro2dx3DS Friend Code: 1461-7084-5732
"do you even 18nps"
Personal experience with bar / nobar :

Well playing nobar... helps with playing nobar... (duh)
but not really stamina I think. I think it is good for technique though.

I played nobar up to the point I could clear almost every random 13-footer you can find for ITG. I play on a crappy soft mat that I hold still with greytape.
On the few occasions I had to play on an acutal arcade, with the bar and all, well I could barely pass 14s.

On the other hand, some of my friends who play exclusively with the bar and are able to pass 15-footer, can't do 12s without it.
But it's not because stamina, it's just that playing nobar efficiently is a completely different thing, I'm just used to it, and they don't.

-------------------

Also, I started DDR without a pad. I played without one. With autoplay on stepmania. And it worked, the day I received my pad I could do most songs on heavy. Smile

Also a good thing about DDR X (?) / X2 machines is that they have super easy lifebars. If you come across one, you'd want to try harder songs Wink
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