Thoughts on Bar Hugging

For lack of a more age appropriate word, I'm just going to call it Bar Hugging.

I was down at the strip, and there was this girl playing ITG at an arcade I was going to, and she was pretty good, except that she couldn't play a song without Hugging.

I think using speed mods does make the game easier, and adds a necessity for heightened reflexes, although you could just go the long way and memorize a song to freak people out by playing that song on invisible. I personally won't use them unless it's impossible to read the notes otherwise.

But the need for Hugging is like a trashy romance novel telling itself that it teaches sound virtues. I mean, SURE, you CAN say you're capable of beating a level 13 demon, but where's the pride in that if you can't do it without Hugging the bar?

YES, I do know that people who CAN beat demons without Hugging prefer to hug anyway. YES, I'll acknowledge than even if I hug, I can't do more than an 11, and that's pushing it. But I could beat 11s WITHOUT Bar Hugging (some of them).

I bring this up because although the girl I mentioned was nice, the two Chinese-ish kids with spiky hair and white sweaters made fun of me for playing my custom level 8s and 9s freestyle, even though they could hardly beat Clockwork Genesis while Hugging.

I apologize if there was a past post, but I never read it, never saw it, and it'd obviously be past the 6 month point since it's not even in the first post.

---

Some people need the bar, some people don't need it.

We'll keep it at, "You try doing 16th note streams to a 192 BPM song for 30 seconds and see if you could hold your balance then".

I have nothing with bar raping. Some of the best players in the country play with bar. It doesn't make you any less of a better player.

---

Guilty of bar molesting.

---

Plus, the bar is there for a reason. If you really feel like you are going to fall without it, then by all means use it. Who cares.

There's no way around the physical limits of the human body. The demons of ITG are almost completely impossible to do without memorization, choreography, and rehearsal, unless you use the bar.

It was those two asian guys talking about me behind my back. I mean, there's a niche for Hugging, like there's a niche for... "not Hugging"...

I don't think you get to be an elitist snob until you can beat Vertex 13 W/O the bar. If that ideal were enforced, there would be a lot less people coming to arcades to show how well they can hug.

Again, don't get me wrong, I'm not so far against Hugging. I just think braggarts who can't beat it barless don't have the right.

EDIT: NEMEsetup, I do agree with you there. If I'm tired, I'll grab the bar while playing Saturn during the opening 16th triples because of how stupid they are.

Derkomai, actually, I can do that at 192 bpm. I think I know what song you're talking about, but yes, I can't actually do that barless because of how you have to turn and feint turn like, 5 times during that whole sequences. But if it was only the same two arrows (boring as hell) or if the switches were simple (might be entertaining if the choreography were good) I could do that without overexerting myself.

That makes me think: I use the tip of my feet as springs to rapidly tap arrows, where as most new players think you need to be a jackhammer to make a step register, which causes a lot of bodily recoil. Is there a guide on this website for HOW TO EFFECTIVELY PLAY a Dance Sim? Y'know, maybe by Al or pie?

---

I only use the bar if I'm doing a really fast song or boss song, I think the fastest song I did without the bar is Sakura on Heavy

---

Umm, the most difficult song I can beat barless would be...

Tell

And yes, I can do 12 barless.

EDIT: But I need to turn mines off. I like the idea of mines except that I can't do them... -_-

---

What's wrong with bar raping? I see nothing wrong with it. That being said, I don't use the bar myself since it's horribly awkward using the bar the few times I go to arcades in a year.

I think barless is the way to go. (for me anyways) mainly becuase you gain much more stamina like that and just saying you can beat pluto relinquish 18 is something to be proud of. Plus it's for people to watch and you don't look like your struggling. Using the bar though can help with some songs like Healing-D-Vision's crossovers (I've tried to do those w/o bar and it's almost impossible) or Blood Rush's constant stream. But I rarely if ever try to use the bar.

I am a bar guy. Don't even THINK about changing the way I play. Some people think that using the bar is cheating, and I say, NO, it isn't. It's just another way of playing.

---

I rest my case. Bar hugging is essential for improvement. Thanks to that, I've managed to complete all songs on ITG.

---

I only bar hug when I'm doing 10+'s at the arcades because I always seem to be slipping around on the mat...

---

Ok, I have nothing against using the bar unless you are playing on anything below a 10 footer. Why is this? Because everyone knows it's very easily possible to perform at 9 footer level without the bar. To me, if you are using the bar on 8 footers or below, especially anything below heave/expert, then you are robbing yourself enjoyment of the game. Also, it goes to foster the same mentality of how people in general want instant results. So if you think holding the bar makes you better faster, you'll use it, but honestly, the bar doesn't really benefit a player until it gets to the 10 footer level where using the bar actually allows a player to step faster and with better stamina. Levels below that just takes repeated play and sweat.

I remember when I used to play DDR on light and going home after doing 4s and 5s and having sore legs. Once that didn't hurt, I had to go to 6s to get the same soreness, but every time I notched it up, I got more and more sore. There's a certain satisfaction I got from beating HVAM for the first time, being out of breath, legs in pain. Players I see today, a lot of them focus solely on the physical aspect and try using the bar to get around that. What about the stamina? The need to be able to turn fast? The need to learn how to properly do gallops? The need to be able to do slow and fast songs?

This is not a rant on current players that are really good and use the bar, but rather on new players who think that using the bar is the key to greatness. It's not. Good players today know very well the bar is a technique in a long line of techniques needed to be good at arrow stomping. This is a rant on the new players who have the wrong idea and totally ignore a lot of aspects of building your skill at DDR. Doubles play, playing with and without mods, challenge mode, nonstop mode, turning correctly, galloping, doing 12th note runs, keeping beat during pauses, being able to do songs that aren't stream happy, and properly handling double steps without losing beat.

In short, use the bar if you need to, but if you're using the bar on anything below 10, you're not as good as you think you are. If you use a bar on 10s and above, keep kicking butt

The bar was originally introduced as a safety precaution, which has been exploited by many players.

Me, I try not to use the bar, although I've only played up to mid-9's (or 13's, I should say).

To anyone who's looking to become a serious player (or any n00b at an arcade who thinks you're supposed to hug the bar ), I say first learn to play without it, and then see where it goes once you reach the high level charts.

---

I only use the bar when I need to, as in to save my ass when I'm about to fall. I've only bar-hogged one song, one time. The first time I played Dragon Blade , I was unfamiliar with the chart, so I bar-hogged that song, and passed with a B. After that, I hardly bar-hog that song, and I don't play that song (or many 8's) frequently. Put it simply, to each his/her own. I don't knock people who bar-hog, say, DAIKENKAI . I DO look down on people who bar-hog anything lower than a 7-footer.

I won't quite Daiz, but he gets closer to the issue than I originally intended to. True, not all bar huggers are snobs, but most of them are. The local Huggers at SVGL look down on me because the toughest SN2 song I can pass is Pluto. Well, I'M not hugging the bar.

Relinquish, I think, w/o the major changes, isn't much tougher than the original. What I hate about the most demonic SN reds is that they had all of these crazy unnecessary speed changes. I mean, the song isn't THAT fast -_-.

So yeah, the highest I can do is about 400-500 BPM, and after that it gets to be too fast for me to read.

---

Pluto is cake compared to Tell. If you can do Tell, you should be able to do Phoenix or Hades.
Something doesn't match up here...

Anway, using the bar has its place. Going for a good score, or a pass on an unfamiliar song, being dependant on high speed mods, or just being tired.

Personally, I only use the bar when I play Max 300 doubles or HVAM doubles at the arcade. Max 300 because I prefer to read it at 1.5x, but Extreme has that stupid bg video distracting me, HVAM because I prefer 2x but again, it has a moronic bg that turns bright blue often. Yes, that kind of stupid shit does lower reaction times. I'd be no barring both at the arcade if the bg videos weren't such shit.

---

Tell 12 isn't full of BPM changes and crossovers (it does have crossovers, but not so bad...)

I can't do songs like Hades and Pheonix because of the BPM changes. I simply can't do crossovers that fast. A partial limiting factor in my performance is that I weigh 180 pounds, and no, the upper body portion of that is NOT muscle. Also, Hades does this thing where it has a diag jump right after a crazy crossover. That doesn't even include the slow, high voltage portion that is just friggin' annoying. At most I just barely survive the slowdown, and then the sudden speedup finishes me off.

I can beat Tell 12 when I have mines off. I can't otherwise.

---

How tall are you? I was doing 10 footers at 245lbs and 5'8". I now weigh 204lbs and play quite a bit better, but nevertheless, I was playing pretty well being 80 lbs overweight ;)