CS IIDX lag problems

I recently finished acquiring all of the IIDX games on PS2, and decided to go back and play through them. The problem is that there is significant lag on the games, at first I assumed it was due to the LCD TV I was playing on, so I switched over to a CRT. Unfortunately even on the CRT, the lag is well above the +/-5 that the game can adjust, which is odd considering CRTs are known for being nearly lagless.

For comparison, I've cleared about 90% of 6's and am working through 7's and 8's, but on the PS2 with lag I'm failing 4's.

Where along the chain do you guys think the lag might be? TV? PS2? Controller Issues? Any thoughts?

You don't happen to be playing on an HDCRT do you? Because those do have lag like any flatscreen will have.

What are the model numbers of the displays you are using? I find it strange that you cannot find a comfortable offset within +/-5. Most displays (good or bad) should fall in that range. Although I wouldn't switch it too much as it can throw off your sense of timing.

I would suggest finding a song you can use as your "sync song". Something that you can listen to how you play the keysounds and determine whether you're hitting early or late. I found Anisakis from DJ Troopers good for that, particularly calmdown after the beginning part. After that alter the offset based on your results and repeat.

If you're still having troubles finding a good offset, I would pin it possibly on the television. The controller should be fine as I've never heard of any delay issues coming from a faulty controller (bad adapters is another story though). It could be your sense of timing too. What did you use to play prior to the CS titles? It could be that you were given a false impression of what the timing was.

Actually on the topic of CS titles, some versions I found had weird timing. I've played on 8th Style through Empress on the PS2 on a typical SDCRT. Out of the bunch, the timing for Happy Sky and 8th Style felt off to me.

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I know my big screen HD TV I can't play CS IIDX because they sync is so damn bad that I can't even fix it int he options. I have a smaller HDTV but I don't know if that will work any better, I've never tried it yet.

It might also be your controller layout. I'm so use to playing in the arcades that playing with a KOC seems weird. I can do 8s and 9s on arcade but have issues with 7s on CS. I feel like the turntable on the KOC is way too sensitive but that's just a personal preference.

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Nope it isn't an HDCRT. It's some sort of Hitachi. It's old enough that the model number has been worn off, but we've dated the TV to late 70's / early 80's.


I did actually try this with a few songs (Bahran Attack Nekomaster Remix, Mendes, Ballad for You). I also compared timing between AC and CS version of the song.


I'm used to playing on a AC for about 6 months now, and prior to that I spent around a year and a half playing CS on a Sony LEDTV with adjusted timing. My concern is that I have tried 3 TVs and they have all had horrific amounts of latency. I'm concerned that it could be the console itself?


I've tested with 9th, 10th, Red, Happy Sky, DistorteD, Gold, Troopers and Empress, and while the timing between games is different, all are experiencing this problem.


I considered that, but I use the same controller for CS and for AC games, so that essentially rules out controller issues. It's a USKOC with a turntable mod and shaved keys.

I doubt it. It will almost always have something to do with either the display used or your sense of timing. Playing on the PC can definitely lead to a scrambled sense of timing since there are additional factors that affect latency. Same goes for playing on HD displays though not as much.

Hold the CRT (regular 4:3 SD) setup with an offset of 0 to be the pivot point for timing. Try another one (if you can) if you feel yours is off. If it's still the case, then continue to stick with it and try your best to adjust. I had a similar experience when I played CS IIDX on an LCDTV and transitioned to a CRT. It feels really off for a bit, but after a handful of rounds it starts to sink in.

For me, it helped reset my timing and gave a better idea of what felt early and what felt late.


How is the USKOC connected to the PC? Devices like PS2->USB adapters are generally seen as unreliable.

Small aside: It's not officially stated, but speaking about arcade data is not allowed on this forum for legal reasons. It's fine that you were initially unaware, but just keep that in mind in the future.

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I'll definitely give this a shot and keep pushing on through the PS2 version. It's quite possible that the PC scrambled my sense of timing.


I have indeed been using a PS2 -> USB adapter, although I have a DAO FPS arriving in the mail any day now, so that will no longer be an issue.

Parallel Port

Parallel port is pretty good, but I think it's getting to the obsolete stage now haha.


I've heard lots of weird stories about USB adapters with IIDX controllers. Many of them do have a delay, but I've heard some feel like they have a variable delay and some don't even work.

The FPS is a great controller though, so that will solve any issue of delay on the controller side (PC-wise). The newer DAOs also have an improved PCB with better PC support. Older ones had a 30ms delay for the turntable and operated more like a KOC (even though it had much more potential).

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It's looking like it was likely the case where I was used to the bad timing on the PS2 Adapter. The first rounds I had with my FPS were pretty weak but once I got used to it my timing SIGNIFICANTLY improved. (Previously was getting D's or C's most of the time, now I'm getting B's and A's).

I have yet to test on PS2, but you were likely right about the PC messing up my timing.

Thanks!

On this topic [an issue which is still bothering me trying to get timing sorted on my new TV] - does using S-video/composite work any better than component [RBG}?

Im using component for the better picture quality but wonder if things will improve slightly using composite/svid. Timing isnt too bad in game mode, but its not great. I was hoping by now new TVs would have almost made this issue disappear......

And lastly - are beatmania games on PS2 480i or 480P resolution?

As far as I can tell, having used my PS2 on a single TV using both Component, S-Video and Composite, there is no noticable difference in the input/lag between them.

If I remember correctly, it is 480i, but I don't have any concrete sources besides some old forum speculations.

Tested last night - they all seem to be 480i.
I found that using Game mode helped a bit as most ppl know - but I made some improvements by switching the game to 4:3, and using the original scaling on my TV [not using Fullscreen/Wide etc]. I dont know exactly which helped, but combined I was better off and it might be worth a try.

I also modified my game mode settings, which is obviously TV dependent. My Bravia's game mode still had a couple of image processors turned on for motion and pixel sharpening which I was able to override and turn off. And now, the lag is pretty much unnoticeable for what Im used to and my timing is set back to +/- 0 in game, using component. [only tested on Empress]. Took about 10 mins of play to adapt to the very slight lag and Im back passing 11's [I was failing 9's before this]