Misrated songs

Not even close. I've played this and many other 15s and 16s. It is sure no 16, and I question it's legitimacy as a 15. It's on the hardest end of 14s.

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Valkyrie dimension is definitely not a 16, there are some 14s that are worse. It's only a 15 because of the gimmicks.

Since I mostly play SP, so let's make one

量子の海のリントヴルム 18 -> 19
There are so many players that even saying that this is the hardest 18 so far, and almost pushing into 19 boundaries. I don't even mind even this is becoming 19 for some reason (or still being 18 and 19 tresholder). Very stamina draining

New Millennium 18 -> 19
Similar to Lindwurm, but this time with irregular and confusing BPM changes and some foot switch

逆月 18 -> 19
Despite lower notecounts than Lindwurm and New Millennium, this chart pushing too much boundaries to be in 18 with 12th note streams and jump spams. If there's a chart that needed to be re-rated, this is very strong candidate

POSSESSION (20th Anniversary Mix) 18 -> 19
At every occasion, I always said that this chart is also pretty strong for re-rating. Not only with tricky BPM changes, but also combination with SA which apparently much much harder than PtF even using dynamic sudden

患部で止まってすぐ溶ける ～ 狂気の優曇華院 17 -> 18
No, just no. This is solid 18, and having even almost tiring and trickier charts than FELM for almost similar BPM range and jumps

Rise as One 18 -> 17
This is pretty controversial, but I don't see 18 material in this chart. Hard 17 ? Yes

BITTER CHOCOLATE STRIKER 18 -> 17
Pretty controversial one, but with lower BPM base and constant BPM, rating this chart into 18 is a little bit.. pretty much ? It's very hard 17 though

Memory//DATAMOSHER 16 -> 17
Irregular BPM changes, plus very stamina draining for 16. Wouldn't mind if this is 17

fluctus 16 -> 17, 13 -> 14
The chart seems very tricky in timing and then adding into very gauge draining ending. Pretty too much for 16. And its is also pretty much for 13 with their timing and gimmicks

嘆きの樹 16 -> 17
After trying this chart again, I'm going to rate this into 17 from relentless streams following by combination of triplets and jumps. Pretty stamina heavy to stay at 16. Definition of Beach Side Bunny of 16

Last card 15 -> 16
I couldn't see this as 15, even though it has almost similar gimmicks to Horatio. With even BPM changes, slightly higher BPM base and more note counts, this is pretty tiring one

灼熱Beach Side Bunny 15 -> 16
After trying this chart more and more, it's very stamina draining with jumps and streams. Wouldn't mind if this become at least easy 16 (or probably mid 16)

Bang Pad(Werk Mix) 13 -> 14, 9 -> 10
The timings vs song are pretty difficult to adjust already. I don't see these are respective level either

桜 13 -> 14, 11 -> 12
Pushing boundaries to the respective level. Pretty hard to score, especially with slowdown (at least, on easier side though for re-rating)

Couleur=Blanche 12 -> 13
Hardest to timing and scoring + SA. As much as its having so much potential for re-rating, I don't see that as 17 material though (but yes, hardest 16)

怒れる大きな白い馬 11 -> 12
If Qipchaq is 12, so do this chart

LOVE❤️SHINE 9 -> 11
No, just no. This is very stamina heavy and tiring one for being a 9, especially with their jumps

蒼い衝動 ～for EXTREME～ 9 -> 10 or 11
The usage of some crossovers and 16th notes pushing this too far for 9, at least to 10 or back into original level 8 (which is 11)

I'd second all of these actually, especially Bang Pad(Werk Mix), mainly for changing rhythms, it's song that you kind of have to play again and again to learn if you're not used to that sort of thing

I also don't really agree with Surrender (PureFocus remix) being a 15? In my eyes it's a 14
and isn't there a general consensus that In the Past is basically a 15?

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In my game of StepMania, I rerated Healing Vision ~Angelic mix~' Single , and charts to 6, 8 and 10 on the old scale respectively. Maybe I should bump up those charts' X-scale ratings by 1 as well.

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Comparing HVAM to Onyx, Onyx is 4 BPM faster, 20 seconds longer, and has 109 more steps and it’s a 14.05 on Sanbai. I don’t feel like HVAM does enough to be a 14.00 compared to Onyx. Maybe that’s just my familiarity with the song from playing it for so many more years than Onyx though.

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I liked the first three pieces of evidence you put there, but not the one I put in italics. First, on Sanbai, 14.00 is not "harder than 13.95". Sanbai ratings compare scoring difficulty among charts in a given folder, rather than indicate what would be good candidates for promotion or demotion. A chart like ONYX with only 8th notes at a constant speed would inevitably be easier to get high scores in compared to the rest of the folder. If HVAM was put in the 14 folder, it would almost certainly be ranked higher than 14.00 on that site.

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TRUE LOVE 15 -> 14

Gale Rider 16 -> 17

I know how Sanbai works, it’s why the sub-ratings for some songs shift around from time to time. HVAM isn’t 13.95, though. It’s 13.30. It’s relatively low. People speculate where songs would fall on Sanbai’s ratings all the time (either if it was re-rated or once it’s no longer too new to be excluded), it doesn’t mean they don’t know how the site works (I don’t remember the exact math but I know it’s based on scores on eamusement) it’s just an educated guess where the song would fall. And HVAM is so far down the list of 13s that compared to a similar 14 I just don’t think there’s room for it in the 14 folder.

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I think you misunderstand Sanbai, then. HVAM is listed as 13.30 on Sanbai - let's break that down:

What it means: "Based on a calculation using eAmusement scores, HVAM is harder to score than about 30% of all charts among 13s."

What it does NOT mean: "HVAM is 30% away from being a 12, and 70% away from being a 14."

Again, Sanbai does not at all indicate whether HVAM is appropriate as a 13. People consistently mentioned Bang Pad(Werk Mix) as being misrated, yet, it's sitting at 13.55 - why? It still loses to all the gimmicky charts that exist in 13s in terms of the scoring formula used there, even though it is much harder to clear than them.

I wrote that 14.00 is not "harder than 13.95", and this is what I meant. 14.00 is just "easiest to score among all charts that exist among 14s". These charts would also be among the easiest to score among 13s, even if clearing them is more difficult.

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I don’t misunderstand. I’m saying that I feel like between HVAM’s differences from Onyx and how many people have good scores on it that 14 isn’t justified. If I said my PBs on Onyx and HVAM have a 21 Perfect difference so I feel like there is a difficulty gap there, whether someone agreed or not they would likely see where I’m coming from, right? Referencing where a song places on Sanbai is the same thing.

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A 21 Perfect difference could come from the smallest things, like being more consistent at one song than the other due to sync, BPM, familiarity with steps, etc. and Onyx simply having significantly more steps. To me, that's a poor argument that a difficulty gap exists there. If Onyx was rated 13 instead of 14, it would also rank pretty low among 13s, simply because it has nothing more complicated than 8ths - would you then say that Onyx being a 14 isn't justified?

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I said in my first comment that it might be because I have more familiarity with HVAM.

I still think that HVAM would place low on the 14 graph and that it would look out of place next to the other 14s. Like I said, people make speculation on where a song would fall if it was re-rated or when it’s new. This is just me saying if it was re-rated I can’t see it being higher than Onyx and that it would look out of place with the other 14s. Speculating is about all someone can do when they don’t have the numbers necessary to plug into the formula Sanbai uses to make its graphs. I don’t know exactly how many people have what score on either song but based on the differences between them that I already mentioned I’m making the educated guess that more people have higher scores on HVAM than Onyx and other 14s.

Like the Sanbai thing was just me saying based on how many people seem to have high scores on them that I think they’re fine. Thats it and I don’t see how that equates to me not understanding how Sanbai sub-rates songs.

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Yeah that's fine, I'm not here to dispute with your opinion. I'm here to discuss why I liked most of your arguments but not the Sanbai one, to discuss why HVAM should/should not be rerated.

P.S. If anyone that has the data used on Sanbai for HVAM and ONYX, you are welcome to tell us where HVAM would place in the 14 folder and where ONYX would place in the 13 folder. Either way, Sanbai does not tell you whether either chart is wrong or right to be where they are at.

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