Post #1 · Posted at 2009-02-08 10:07:51am 15.2 years ago
 Max | |
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The reason why i am putting up this thread is because of what just happened just recently in my area...
One year ago, i entered a teen tournament hosted by our county's libraries and junk. This tournament was their first Teen Tournament that they held, and they used Guitar Hero III and DDR SuperNOVA 2 as their main tournament titles.
When i arrived at one of their events, it was PACKED with people for both GH and DDR (which i was amazed at), and thankfully i was able to sign myself up for the DDR Tournament that they had...
...came out First Place Qualifier AND had the highest score for ALL Qualifying events
Here's my proof.Look through the names and you will see the scores from the events).
So i became the first place qualifier, giving me a guaranteed chair in the "Grand Championships", i came, beat out 20 kids, and SOMEHOW ended up second place (by a kid who i will have to admit WAS and maybe IS better than me AT THE TIME, but i could beat him on other songs...like FELM
) And that was the end of that day, i got a Red iPod Shuffle (which i gave to my little brother and he was as happy as ever...) and i had a REALLY good time playing against other Expert DDR Players...
Then comes this year's tournament...what a flop. Pretty much (i am guessing) to keep up with the times, they DROP the GH and DDR Tournaments and move onto something else...a Rock Band 2 "Battle of the Bands" Tournament. No GH Tournament, and no DDR Tournament, JUST Rock Band 2...reason why i say it is a flop is because around two hours ago i went over to one of their qualifying events (only reason i went was to give the lady who was running the tournaments, who ALSO held the DDR tournaments the year before, give her a "sample" of DDR X, which i think i have convinced her enough to get). I went to the event and guess what? Only 10 or 11 people were there (including parents and the staff). Last year, i could say that they had over 50 teens, not including parents and staff!
Ok, so if there is JUST a Rock Band 2, then why am i going over there to give her my data for DDR X? Apparently at the "Grand Championships" she will hold GH and DDR "challenges" as the main tournament is going on...i gave her some challenges (i gave her a "maxninja special" edit of SABER WING, and also a MAXNINJA CHALLENGE Course which includes 20 of my favorite songs on one nonstop course). And that's about it, however i think one of the main reasons why i didn't see as much people as last year was maybe because 1. it's Rock Band 2...why really HAS this game as a whole to compete as a band? and 2. It started at around 6:30pm...even on a Saturday night, it's a little bit late to go over to the place.
So here is my question (sorry for making you guys read so much >_< you can bash on my long explanations later...):
What do you guys think would make a GOOD tournament good? Like, how would you make a tournament so that people can come or are interested in coming? I may be jumping to conclusions, but i just don't think that a RB2 Tourney is gonna attract as much attention as a GH and DDR tourney...if they kept it the same, i would guess they would get more people than what i saw today...idk besides i have the number of the lady that runs "half" of the tournament, i MIGHT be able to convince her to try and get a DDR stand-alone tourney...or add in another game or something >_>
One year ago, i entered a teen tournament hosted by our county's libraries and junk. This tournament was their first Teen Tournament that they held, and they used Guitar Hero III and DDR SuperNOVA 2 as their main tournament titles.
When i arrived at one of their events, it was PACKED with people for both GH and DDR (which i was amazed at), and thankfully i was able to sign myself up for the DDR Tournament that they had...
...came out First Place Qualifier AND had the highest score for ALL Qualifying events
Here's my proof.Look through the names and you will see the scores from the events).So i became the first place qualifier, giving me a guaranteed chair in the "Grand Championships", i came, beat out 20 kids, and SOMEHOW ended up second place (by a kid who i will have to admit WAS and maybe IS better than me AT THE TIME, but i could beat him on other songs...like FELM
) And that was the end of that day, i got a Red iPod Shuffle (which i gave to my little brother and he was as happy as ever...) and i had a REALLY good time playing against other Expert DDR Players...Then comes this year's tournament...what a flop. Pretty much (i am guessing) to keep up with the times, they DROP the GH and DDR Tournaments and move onto something else...a Rock Band 2 "Battle of the Bands" Tournament. No GH Tournament, and no DDR Tournament, JUST Rock Band 2...reason why i say it is a flop is because around two hours ago i went over to one of their qualifying events (only reason i went was to give the lady who was running the tournaments, who ALSO held the DDR tournaments the year before, give her a "sample" of DDR X, which i think i have convinced her enough to get). I went to the event and guess what? Only 10 or 11 people were there (including parents and the staff). Last year, i could say that they had over 50 teens, not including parents and staff!
Ok, so if there is JUST a Rock Band 2, then why am i going over there to give her my data for DDR X? Apparently at the "Grand Championships" she will hold GH and DDR "challenges" as the main tournament is going on...i gave her some challenges (i gave her a "maxninja special" edit of SABER WING, and also a MAXNINJA CHALLENGE Course which includes 20 of my favorite songs on one nonstop course). And that's about it, however i think one of the main reasons why i didn't see as much people as last year was maybe because 1. it's Rock Band 2...why really HAS this game as a whole to compete as a band? and 2. It started at around 6:30pm...even on a Saturday night, it's a little bit late to go over to the place.
So here is my question (sorry for making you guys read so much >_< you can bash on my long explanations later...):
What do you guys think would make a GOOD tournament good? Like, how would you make a tournament so that people can come or are interested in coming? I may be jumping to conclusions, but i just don't think that a RB2 Tourney is gonna attract as much attention as a GH and DDR tourney...if they kept it the same, i would guess they would get more people than what i saw today...idk besides i have the number of the lady that runs "half" of the tournament, i MIGHT be able to convince her to try and get a DDR stand-alone tourney...or add in another game or something >_>
Post #2 · Posted at 2009-02-08 10:19:57am 15.2 years ago
| Zukin-Man | |
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From what I've noticed, good tournaments usually occur when...
1. There's plenty of time for word to get around. If an arcade decides to have a tournament a week from when they first thought about it, that's not a lot of time for word to spread and for more serious players to take time off work, school, what have you.
2. The entry fee is either free, low, or reasonable. No one wants to spend $20 to get blasted in the first round. Enjoy your $20 game.
3. The more popular players are attending. Not necessarily the BETTER players, just the more POPULAR ones. When the well-liked players come by, people want to see them and hang out with them.
4. Good prizes can help, but most tourney-going players either play for the competition, or just to see old DDR friends. The best tournament I went to only gave out free tokens to the winners, but everyone enjoyed themselves.
These are just my own observations. Individual results may vary. Some assembly required.
1. There's plenty of time for word to get around. If an arcade decides to have a tournament a week from when they first thought about it, that's not a lot of time for word to spread and for more serious players to take time off work, school, what have you.
2. The entry fee is either free, low, or reasonable. No one wants to spend $20 to get blasted in the first round. Enjoy your $20 game.
3. The more popular players are attending. Not necessarily the BETTER players, just the more POPULAR ones. When the well-liked players come by, people want to see them and hang out with them.
4. Good prizes can help, but most tourney-going players either play for the competition, or just to see old DDR friends. The best tournament I went to only gave out free tokens to the winners, but everyone enjoyed themselves.
These are just my own observations. Individual results may vary. Some assembly required.
Post #3 · Posted at 2009-02-08 10:59:54am 15.2 years ago
| Max | |
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Quote: Zukin-Man
From what I've noticed, good tournaments usually occur when...
1. There's plenty of time for word to get around. If an arcade decides to have a tournament a week from when they first thought about it, that's not a lot of time for word to spread and for more serious players to take time off work, school, what have you.
2. The entry fee is either free, low, or reasonable. No one wants to spend $20 to get blasted in the first round. Enjoy your $20 game.
3. The more popular players are attending. Not necessarily the BETTER players, just the more POPULAR ones. When the well-liked players come by, people want to see them and hang out with them.
4. Good prizes can help, but most tourney-going players either play for the competition, or just to see old DDR friends. The best tournament I went to only gave out free tokens to the winners, but everyone enjoyed themselves.
These are just my own observations. Individual results may vary. Some assembly required.
Yea, this tournament does give a out a "grand prize", i mean i don't know what it is for this year, but last year it was a Rock Band complete kit for the PS3 or Xbox 360...heck, if i beat that kid i would have been able to use that FOR this year's tournament (a little bit lol)...1. There's plenty of time for word to get around. If an arcade decides to have a tournament a week from when they first thought about it, that's not a lot of time for word to spread and for more serious players to take time off work, school, what have you.
2. The entry fee is either free, low, or reasonable. No one wants to spend $20 to get blasted in the first round. Enjoy your $20 game.
3. The more popular players are attending. Not necessarily the BETTER players, just the more POPULAR ones. When the well-liked players come by, people want to see them and hang out with them.
4. Good prizes can help, but most tourney-going players either play for the competition, or just to see old DDR friends. The best tournament I went to only gave out free tokens to the winners, but everyone enjoyed themselves.
These are just my own observations. Individual results may vary. Some assembly required.
...and i agree, around the first or second day of February they announce the tournament, which gave them three or four days until the first event started, so it gave them and other people little time to begin to get the hype of this tournament up. They ALWAYS have the tournaments for free, i would think that if you would have to pay for a tournament, it's a rip/risk because you enter the tournament for...$20 and you get blasted in the first round? Then where is the fun in that?
And i don't quite get what you are saying by POPULAR players being a better choice than BETTER players...i mean, if i was second place winner for the DDR tourney, and i was a very fair and very well-liked person there, then would that count?
Post #4 · Posted at 2009-02-08 11:10:40am 15.2 years ago
| Pandemonium X | |
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Quote: maxninja09
they DROP the GH and DDR Tournaments and move onto something else...a Rock Band 2 "Battle of the Bands" Tournament.
There's you're problem. If it was such a success the 1st time with GH & DDR, then why would they change it?
If it works, stick with is as I'm told.
Maybe they where trying something new.
Post #5 · Posted at 2009-02-08 11:14:42am 15.2 years ago
| Max | |
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Quote: Pandemonium X
There's you're problem. If it was such a success the 1st time with GH & DDR, then why would they change it? If it works, stick with is as I'm told. Maybe they where trying something new.
If it works, stick with is as I'm told. Maybe they where trying something new.Quote: maxninja09
Pretty much (i am guessing) to keep up with the times...
Sums up my response, i can take a WILD guess and say that they thought that "OH! Let's have a RB2 Tourney! cuz you KNOW RB2 is HUGE for Tournaments right? 
" ....*sigh* i will talk to the lady AFTER the Grand tournament happens (that is, if there is ALOT of people for that day then idk...)..and why do i have the sudden feeling that once DJ Hero or Scratch comes out, they will jump in the bandwagon and set those games for NEXT year's tourney...but if i can score a job at their place, THINK AGAIN!
Post #6 · Posted at 2009-02-08 08:01:02pm 15.2 years ago
| stsung | |
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um....
the best most enjoyable tournament for me was a small DDR tournament with maybe 30-40 people from France, Belgium and Netherlands. It was held at the most unlikely place - a train station somewhere no one would ever go to
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We had to pay 5EUR to enter the tournament. there were light, standard and expert tournament. I competed in the expert tournament ending up 5th, which was the best achievement for me and still probably counts as one....(I don't care about third place at world championship or second place at European one). I would consider this tournament the most messed up one in terms of organization but somehow...people came there and it was loads of fun and a really good players came (the top players - we met at the European championships next time)
what I wanted to say is....that usually small tournaments that are completely unprepared end up being better than those official and being announced long before they start. Many improvised tournaments I went to were much more fun and people were much more relaxed and that's probably the thing. If you go there for fun it's nice. If you go to a tournament to win it usually isn't that fun. I remember Polish ITG tournament which started at 9pm and ended up around 1 am (speaking about the final bracket). In the finals I was supposed to play Pandemonium Expert and I thought that I won't even be able to stand up for the finals... (being in the winners bracket all the time has a disadvantage....you don't play that often.)
Probably competitions at cons kind of go into this category as well. The participants of the tournaments are usually the people coming there for the con. Usually people that go there to enjoy themselves, have fun, meet other players etc. Competition is good between the players but everything stays at a level that is good for everyone. Without challenge it wouldn't be fun as well. But it's usually a tournament where individual players try to do their best for themselves. To see if they can challenge themselves. The attitude is different. It's not about "I gotta beat this player".
Tournaments that are being organized ahead and are sponsored and with prizes usually tend to get primarily those people who just want to be the best and want to win something and few of those who just come for the fun (different kind of people coming and usually not knowing each other). Usually those people are disappointed afterwards about the tournament as people are more serious about the tournament. These tournaments usually have payed entry and many times it's not just 5 bucks. It's usually more. I don't have good experiences with such tournaments.
The tournaments that usually go well and are announced ahead and organized this way are actually tourney's in something new. when the level is not that high and people go there more to try it not to really win anything.
My tournament nightmare....=> (that's what happens when people take it too seriously)
I went to a Guitar Hero 3 tournament in our country and it was a shock for me. the people there wanted to show that they are the best and that they want to qualify for "world championships". when they saw me play for the first time and they knew that I beat them by far they got really offended by that. They were asking me questions about the songs, about my technique.... they were trying to find out my weaknesses. I did not feel that good and decided to become 2nd at most (well I wanted to avoid qualifying for the world champ - as I consider myself pretty lame at the game). It was so tense ... no one was relaxed, everyone was concentrating and trying his best. They were watching others to see their weaknesses. These people were playing the songs over and over to learn them and get the highest scores at home so they would prove they are the best. But for me that's not what I consider fair and the person doing this wouldn't count as a good player to me either. A good player is the one that can naturally do this without whoring those songs. Of course the winner of this goddamn tournament was a person that can hardly play anything he hasn't "studied" for the tournament (as the songs were given two weeks before it) but decided to be simply the first. Is that a good tournament? No, it's not. Unfair (if I just skip the fact that GH games are not for serious tournaments anyway), not fun and full of elitists. It had few moments which were nice for me ... like me getting some golden stars on a song and others staring at me but well I would never participate in such a tournament once again. not worth my time and money (and my nerves).
Personally I hate when people come to a tournament and are decided to win no matter what. European Champion in female's division is like that. and I hate this. I would simply let her win no matter what as I just hate this attitude. it's something that spoils everything for me. Even though I have to agree that this is the way people should probably play if they want to get to the highest ranking. it's just not considered fair for my consciousness....
the best most enjoyable tournament for me was a small DDR tournament with maybe 30-40 people from France, Belgium and Netherlands. It was held at the most unlikely place - a train station somewhere no one would ever go to
. We had to pay 5EUR to enter the tournament. there were light, standard and expert tournament. I competed in the expert tournament ending up 5th, which was the best achievement for me and still probably counts as one....(I don't care about third place at world championship or second place at European one). I would consider this tournament the most messed up one in terms of organization but somehow...people came there and it was loads of fun and a really good players came (the top players - we met at the European championships next time)
what I wanted to say is....that usually small tournaments that are completely unprepared end up being better than those official and being announced long before they start. Many improvised tournaments I went to were much more fun and people were much more relaxed and that's probably the thing. If you go there for fun it's nice. If you go to a tournament to win it usually isn't that fun. I remember Polish ITG tournament which started at 9pm and ended up around 1 am (speaking about the final bracket). In the finals I was supposed to play Pandemonium Expert and I thought that I won't even be able to stand up for the finals... (being in the winners bracket all the time has a disadvantage....you don't play that often.)
Probably competitions at cons kind of go into this category as well. The participants of the tournaments are usually the people coming there for the con. Usually people that go there to enjoy themselves, have fun, meet other players etc. Competition is good between the players but everything stays at a level that is good for everyone. Without challenge it wouldn't be fun as well. But it's usually a tournament where individual players try to do their best for themselves. To see if they can challenge themselves. The attitude is different. It's not about "I gotta beat this player".
Tournaments that are being organized ahead and are sponsored and with prizes usually tend to get primarily those people who just want to be the best and want to win something and few of those who just come for the fun (different kind of people coming and usually not knowing each other). Usually those people are disappointed afterwards about the tournament as people are more serious about the tournament. These tournaments usually have payed entry and many times it's not just 5 bucks. It's usually more. I don't have good experiences with such tournaments.
The tournaments that usually go well and are announced ahead and organized this way are actually tourney's in something new. when the level is not that high and people go there more to try it not to really win anything.
My tournament nightmare....=> (that's what happens when people take it too seriously)
I went to a Guitar Hero 3 tournament in our country and it was a shock for me. the people there wanted to show that they are the best and that they want to qualify for "world championships". when they saw me play for the first time and they knew that I beat them by far they got really offended by that. They were asking me questions about the songs, about my technique.... they were trying to find out my weaknesses. I did not feel that good and decided to become 2nd at most (well I wanted to avoid qualifying for the world champ - as I consider myself pretty lame at the game). It was so tense ... no one was relaxed, everyone was concentrating and trying his best. They were watching others to see their weaknesses. These people were playing the songs over and over to learn them and get the highest scores at home so they would prove they are the best. But for me that's not what I consider fair and the person doing this wouldn't count as a good player to me either. A good player is the one that can naturally do this without whoring those songs. Of course the winner of this goddamn tournament was a person that can hardly play anything he hasn't "studied" for the tournament (as the songs were given two weeks before it) but decided to be simply the first. Is that a good tournament? No, it's not. Unfair (if I just skip the fact that GH games are not for serious tournaments anyway), not fun and full of elitists. It had few moments which were nice for me ... like me getting some golden stars on a song and others staring at me but well I would never participate in such a tournament once again. not worth my time and money (and my nerves).
Personally I hate when people come to a tournament and are decided to win no matter what. European Champion in female's division is like that. and I hate this. I would simply let her win no matter what as I just hate this attitude. it's something that spoils everything for me. Even though I have to agree that this is the way people should probably play if they want to get to the highest ranking. it's just not considered fair for my consciousness....
Post #7 · Posted at 2009-02-08 08:13:40pm 15.2 years ago
| Oni-91 | |
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I loved the DDR:UK UK qualifiers. There's about 10 of them (all around the UK and ROI), and they only cost £5 to enter. While up to 2008, it WAS possible to play 1 game and get eliminated (yeah, a $10 game), this year's one's supposedly going to have a double elimination bracket, so everyone plays at least twice, and someone eliminated can actually still win (though I suspect there's a price increase, possibly to £7.50 or something). And all these qualifiers culminate in an epic final at the London MCM in October (which is always awesome). Also, the UK DDR players are all awesome, with pretty much no exceptions (the single exception being me).
Post #8 · Posted at 2009-02-09 05:36:26am 15.2 years ago
| Max | |
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@ stsung: well it just really depends on the kinds of tournament people WANT more, and so far, from what i saw the kids were just there having fun...
...although the year before MANY of them were there to beat the highest score on GH (including me, but in DDR) and that was the whole point of the tournament for that year, to get the highest score and be able to win a chair at the "Grand Championship"...
I didn't like it/did like it because you HAD to practice for the songs but at the same time you are more concentrated on getting the higher score and not really have much fun playing...
...but aren't all tournaments like that? I mean, the purpose of a tournament is to see who is the best, right? I really don't see tournaments where you just come and play and have fun by playing against others, i mean if that's the case then just plan a little get together and there
At my "Grand Championship" meet, i felt it more like a fun tournament that time because i just played like i always do, and somehow was able to beat everyone else except for that one guy...and let me tell you, he is pretty knowledgeable on DDR AND ITG, he is pretty much the "i'm entering this tournament to win the prize" kinda guy while i am the "i don;t care what prize i get, i just want to see how far i will last in the tournament and have fun with the people i meet" kind a guy...
...and guess what? He won, i came in second, but i didn't really care, I HAD FUN! End of discussion...
...and now the host a RB2 tourney...i just don't know how they can handle that kind of tournament, personally, a GH and DDr tournament is much better at handling the scores and junk, but a full band score? I can predict many flaws and errors in score tracking and the such...
I should convince not just the libraries to make a (possible) stand-alone DDR Tournament, i should take to some arcade locations to see if they are interested in doing one...but i highly doubt that's going to happen here in Tampa >_>
...although the year before MANY of them were there to beat the highest score on GH (including me, but in DDR) and that was the whole point of the tournament for that year, to get the highest score and be able to win a chair at the "Grand Championship"...
I didn't like it/did like it because you HAD to practice for the songs but at the same time you are more concentrated on getting the higher score and not really have much fun playing...
...but aren't all tournaments like that? I mean, the purpose of a tournament is to see who is the best, right? I really don't see tournaments where you just come and play and have fun by playing against others, i mean if that's the case then just plan a little get together and there
At my "Grand Championship" meet, i felt it more like a fun tournament that time because i just played like i always do, and somehow was able to beat everyone else except for that one guy...and let me tell you, he is pretty knowledgeable on DDR AND ITG, he is pretty much the "i'm entering this tournament to win the prize" kinda guy while i am the "i don;t care what prize i get, i just want to see how far i will last in the tournament and have fun with the people i meet" kind a guy...
...and guess what? He won, i came in second, but i didn't really care, I HAD FUN! End of discussion...
...and now the host a RB2 tourney...i just don't know how they can handle that kind of tournament, personally, a GH and DDr tournament is much better at handling the scores and junk, but a full band score? I can predict many flaws and errors in score tracking and the such...
I should convince not just the libraries to make a (possible) stand-alone DDR Tournament, i should take to some arcade locations to see if they are interested in doing one...but i highly doubt that's going to happen here in Tampa >_>
Post #9 · Posted at 2009-02-09 06:49:42am 15.2 years ago
| stsung | |
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well, you are right. but for me tournament is not what shows who's the best. because many times it's not the best player winning. it's the player wanting it the most. if you get what I mean....well it depends on the tournament and players competing but still....
Post #10 · Posted at 2009-02-09 07:01:51am 15.2 years ago
| Bolt-Edge | |
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Not around here.
I've been to I believe 7 tournaments, and I wanted to win so badly in each of them.
Best I got was 2nd, and that was in the lower division. I'm now considered upper division here in Ohio. Even if I did try my hardest, my 3 greats on Rain of Sorrow just doesn't cut it anymore when you're up against people like Kevbo and Dr. D (if you're reading this, sup come back to Ohio) to name a couple.
It's pretty much impossible for me to even place in tournaments anymore. This state is filled with people who are really good at the game, and even if my scores are a little impressive, I still have no chance in a tournament anymore.
The thing is, I don't go to tournaments anymore for the competition; I go to see my friends and meet new friends from around the state.
The social aspect of tournaments is what draws a lot of people in. You got to have a lot of people come or it just loses its appeal.
I've been to I believe 7 tournaments, and I wanted to win so badly in each of them.
Best I got was 2nd, and that was in the lower division. I'm now considered upper division here in Ohio. Even if I did try my hardest, my 3 greats on Rain of Sorrow just doesn't cut it anymore when you're up against people like Kevbo and Dr. D (if you're reading this, sup come back to Ohio) to name a couple.
It's pretty much impossible for me to even place in tournaments anymore. This state is filled with people who are really good at the game, and even if my scores are a little impressive, I still have no chance in a tournament anymore.
The thing is, I don't go to tournaments anymore for the competition; I go to see my friends and meet new friends from around the state.
The social aspect of tournaments is what draws a lot of people in. You got to have a lot of people come or it just loses its appeal.
Post #11 · Posted at 2009-02-09 11:33:30pm 15.1 years ago
| Max | |
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...We need events or "tournaments" that are just for the fun of it, not for who REALLY wants to win.
...basically, the terms "Tournament" or "contest" spark a competitve drive once you hear those words, which basically insists on you competing with other people to be the best...but i would rather go to a "tournament" to have fun WHILE i am playing against other people...
...i guess it just doesn't seem to be the case nowadays
...basically, the terms "Tournament" or "contest" spark a competitve drive once you hear those words, which basically insists on you competing with other people to be the best...but i would rather go to a "tournament" to have fun WHILE i am playing against other people...
...i guess it just doesn't seem to be the case nowadays
Post #12 · Posted at 2009-02-10 03:56:25am 15.1 years ago
| silenttype01 | |
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Then don't reveal the prizes. Just say that it's a special prize and that everyone wins. When they ask for the prize, you show them the tournament that they just participated in. Make it a really cheesy moment.
Post #13 · Posted at 2009-02-10 09:10:38am 15.1 years ago
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Quote: silenttype01
Then don't reveal the prizes. Just say that it's a special prize and that everyone wins. When they ask for the prize, you show them the tournament that they just participated in. Make it a really cheesy moment.
And have a quick escape route planned. ;)I think what matters the most is the size and attitude of the local community. I'm in a very small community of players (~20 people), who mostly play for fun. For the PIU tournament on Saturday, 7 people showed up for the crazy bracket, so the organizer entered. 3 showed up for hard (one from crazy, was last in crazy). We mostly just chatted during the rounds, nobody was really focused on winning when they weren't actively playing. It seemed like a friendly, barely competitive tournament. It broke up fast after it ended though. Only a couple of us hung around to play afterwards. The tourney was fun overall, but I think it would have been better with a larger group of people. More than 16 people per bracket would have been far too many though.