Player to Player Feedback?

Hello everyone, first thread here (woo!), not sure if this is a legit thread or not to create (or if it's already been created)

This will be a thread where (I hope) experienced players can help share their stuff and give feedback to newer players attempting to work their way up the ranks of DDR.

So with that out of the way... I would like to be the first to ask for some feedback on my playing:

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Heyo! While I don't consider myself a really experienced player (Can't clear upper-15s yet), I don't consider myself inexperienced either. (Technically I'm the no.1 player in town, and the hardest song I can clear is MAX 300 ) I have, however, been playing and lurking enough to have okay knowledge of the series and fanbase within under a year. Before I post my tips, I'll address a few of your ambitions:


I mean, it is good to set the bar (pun intended) high...

Have you seen the 2016 KAC last month? Let me just put it there- Those guys are good. The biggest DDR heavyweights, FEFEMZ and iamchris4life have been practicing and playing the game for over a decade. That's one hurdle you've got to pass.

On the other hand, bar-less play becomes quite an intense challenge in the later levels of DDR. By level 10-12 on the DDR X scale, songs become more draining when you play without the bar, and by level 14-15, almost impossible with civilian levels of stamina. It's not impossible, IIRC there's a video out there of someone clearing Valkyrie Dimension or doubles without using the bar... But just barely. (I'll see if I can find it somewhere) Without the bar, you have only your legs to stabilize yourself through those intense 16th note crossover streams, which isn't fun. But if you're willing to climb a long, painful path of leg building, no one can stop you.

Oh, and speaking of no-bar play, you know what's fun? FREESTYLING.


I don't hear much of it nowadays, mostly just talk of score and PFCs. Freestyling used to be pretty popular back in the day, during the height of classic DDR's popularity. Honestly, I want to see someone freestyle a 15 someday. If you're considering pushing yourself on bar-less play, I'd suggest also considering practicing some freestyle routines for some of your favorite songs. You'll grab the attention of everyone in the room if you're especially good.

But... Good luck AAA-ing Over The Period . There's not really much I can say about that.


Heh, that's one of my biggest goals as well. I'd say that every city should have a well-maintained DDR machine somewhere. It's not just a fun game. It's not just a workout. But, I've seen it bring people together. There's no feeling like stepping up onto the platform with some random stranger. DDR isn't really a competitive game- There's the comparison of scores, sure, but it feels like both players are almost connected in a sense. Going up with a relatively inexperienced player, I feel like I'm guiding and shepherding a new potential player. Going up with a more experienced player, I feel myself pushing myself to achieve greater limits, and ultimately experiencing skill I wouldn't see elsewhere. I've seen DDR bring people together- And I believe it should become more popular because, especially in this age, people need to be brought together. But excuse the minor rant...

Also, it's really, really good cardio, especially on the higher levels. I cleared MAX 300 on half-dead pads. That is a workout.

*fixed

To be blunt, gamers are gamers. Few gamers like to share their secrets, because they want to win. But I guess there really isn't any win-all trick to it... It takes a lot of practice to build up stamina, concentration, leg dexterity, and good timing. Slowly, you build yourself higher and higher- and that's the fun part.

Anyway, here's a few of my tips...

-Practice is important, but even more so with DDR. Not only are you building up leg dexterity, you're also slowly building your leg muscles and stamina up. Especially since I don't have any DDR cabinets at home anymore, I find that finding a dance pad you can plug into your computer and playing Stepmania is really useful for not only building up skill, but studying and practicing harder charts.

-Make sure you eat healthy before you play. I once ate something that made me feel real sluggish, and I had trouble passing 9s and above (X scale, again) without feeling like I was gonna pass out.

-Speaking of which, drink lots of water. I feel dizzy when I don't drink that much water. (I also have to drink one whole bottle of water every 2 games- is that normal/healthy?)

-When playing singles, stepping on the inside corners of the dance pad makes things easier. Unless, of course, the sensors are dead there.

-On the other hand, disregard the above for doubles. You'll step on empty tiles if you aren't careful.

I don't have time to add any more. I'll post more later when I get the chance.

Hey there, Mike!

So I've seen the video you posted, and honestly, for having played for just one month, you play exceptionally well, especially without using a bar.

So here's a few tips on gameplay alone:

- Try to alternate your feet more, and turn your body when you see patterns like L-D-R-D-L. If you step this pattern as Right-Left-Right-Left-Right, you'll turn your body to the left, cross your right foot over, and back. This is what people commonly refer to as a "crossover". While this isn't easy to do when you're new and you're playing a chart for the first time (nor is it always the best idea), getting in the habit of doing this as much as you can will get you pretty far on Doubles mode, since you're interested in getting good at that. It'll initially be more exhausting and difficult since you have to do more movement, but it'll help your balance and help you save energy in the long run.

- You'll learn to control how high you jump later on. Ideally, you want to leap as lightly and as low as you can, so that your feet don't stomp as hard, you save energy, and you time the landing better. Of course, this is much harder to do no-bar. The harder charts in this game can throw jumps at you very quickly, and you might not have enough time to react to them.

- If you find a chart that challenges you, try to find other charts that you can warm up to before trying said chart. (e.g. if MAX 300 is challenging, try practicing something like Across the nightmare before attempting it next time).

You sure like to dream big, don't you?

Honestly, it's one thing to try to actually enter KAC in 5 years, but trying to win it without using a bar just takes that ambition to a whole other inhuman level. So is AAAing Over The Period ever, let alone in 3 years, let alone no-bar. As far as I know, no one has done it yet (not even the most experienced players) even with a bar, even with several attempts. I don't think any of these goals are realistic in the slightest, so I hope you won't be so hard on yourself if these things don't happen to you any time soon. Thanks for the giggles, though.

In all seriousness, these goals (as well your very poor outlook on your current playing ability) convince me that you're a little too ambitious for results (and I don't blame you, it's truly hard to believe you've only played this game for a month). Getting truly good at a game like DDR takes so much effort, so much patience, and guess what? It takes time. You should prioritize having fun with the game, and slowly work your way up. It's important not to overdo anything related to this game. Ideally, you'd want to play 2-3 times a week and not too much longer, since your body needs sufficient time to recover and build muscle memory. You'll probably play more poorly than you otherwise might if you try to play long sessions each day, trying to get better and better. And it happens to us all - we all have that one day when we just fail completely according to our own standards. Don't let it get to you. If you're not having fun with the game, you're probably doing it wrong. So make sure you're having fun above anything else!

Good luck. Let us know how you're doing in a few months, and we'll take it from there! Once again, welcome!

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Hey, thanks for the feedback! I have tried crossovers and in theory, I can do them, but when it comes up in a song, I normally panic and use one foot for two arrows and everything goes awry afterward. How can I train my brain to instinctively react to a crossover pattern on screen when it shows up so I don't panic when it does happen? I've been absolutely failing at Can't Stop Falling In Love (Speed Mix) for the crossover section in the beginning. Are there other songs that have crossovers that are about at that level?

Also, one of my biggest weaknesses right now are jump-taps (I think that's what they're called?) at the moment (i.e. an left-right jump followed by a down arrow in either an quick 8th or 16th run). What songs can I do to work on them and if I have a fast jump-tap stream, (like left down-left right up right left-right down up-down right), how can I train my brain not to panic and get it to be ready for anything that is like that?

I am also a musician (playing guitar for 9 years or so), and I'm not sure if that helps with my sense of timing and DDR in general. Is there any parallel there?

Another thing, how can I read very bunched up rhythms and complicated rhythms such as 24ths and 12ths followed by 16ths (as well as other stuff like that)? Is there any way of being trained to the point where you can see any rhythm and instinctively step it out perfectly without trial and error?

Also, just to let people know, I can clear songs like i feel... and Can't Stop Falling in Love (the original one) as well as other similar songs. 11s-12s (I think? I'm unsure about that) are nearing my limits. Anything with jump-taps, extremely fast streams (think Drop Out from Nonstop Megamix), fast crossovers, or very fast jump-taps will normally make me fail a song.


I always hold myself to a very high standard on basically anything I care about deeply (obviously DDR is one of those things). I just can't help but compare myself to the current KAC champions and the best people around. I just always feel like I'm not good enough and I just am a terrible DDR player simply for not clearing some song that is just beyond my limits or something else. I can't seem to help it at all. My current philosophy is this: If I'm not getting perfect scores on the hardest songs out there that I think are supposed to be in my limits, then I'm not good enough and therefore I'm really bad at DDR.

What can I do to change this?

(Sorry to rapidemboar for not replying yet, I don't have enough time tonight to do so)

Also, just to let everyone know what I have at home to practice, this is it:



Cobalt Flux Schools Pad (finally got it working properly!)
Custom Built Arcade Cabinet (my dad and I worked on it)

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It's mainly a matter of muscle memory. You just need to practice it on lower speeds as much as you could, so on higher speeds, it becomes intuitive. SUNKiSS♥DROP has very basic crossovers at high speed (although that chart has problems of its own). If you want something similar to the chart you mentioned, there's No.13 . There's also exotic ethnic if you want to try for even faster. If you want slow practice because you're failing at higher speeds, TOMORROW is a fairly nice chart. I'll list more charts as you get more and more used to it.

Yeah 8th jumps are pretty tough, especially when you're new. They're harder without a bar since you typically have to leap higher, and as such, you could lose your sense of rhythm. If they trouble your brain now, bar practice isn't a bad idea. You could try without a bar once you're more comfortable. Higher speed modifiers usually help with that since you can space out the arrows more and step in sequence. Try many different songs with a high AIR value on the Groove Radar. GENOM SCREAMS and Second Heaven are two I can think of at the moment.

Since playing a rhythm game and playing a musical instrument both involve using your body to react to a rhythm, absolutely! You should have an upper hand at reading and comprehending rhythms if you're experienced with music itself.

They're easier to see with higher speed modifiers. Tough rhythms are usually hard to do perfectly at first for just about anyone. It helps to watch stepcharts on either StepMania or on YouTube (preferably with Clap assist) if you want to understand rhythms prior to playing something.

I've said this before and I'll say it again. Considering you've only played this game for a month, that's extremely impressive. Most players don't even get to in that short amount of time. 16th death runs take quite some time to master. Don't be surprised if it takes you nearly a year, because that's how long it takes for a lot of people (or quite possibly longer).

I'm glad you understand you're pushing yourself way too hard and you want to change how you think about your playing ability. If you ever think you're terrible just because you can't play like people who have been already playing for 15 years or so, I suggest you think back to what it was like being a 1-year old baby. Yes, a helpless, tiny little child.

No baby would think to himself "I gotta age and grow up already!" No, he would sleep, cry, beg for attention, and keep his parents awake all night, like all normal human beings do at that age. Your mother would watch you crawl, and day by day, you'd learn how to slowly balance yourself and walk on your two feet. You wouldn't look at another neighbor's baby and think "Oh, she's walked a lot further than I did today! I must suck at walking! I have to catch up to her by tomorrow!" Right?

Yeah, set realistic, short-term goals for yourself. For example, if level 11 is your limit to pass today, you can ask yourself if you can see yourself full comboing some of them next month. If you can, see how you'd do by that point.

If you're always driving yourself so hard trying to get results, you'll probably just end up disappointed. You wouldn't enjoy the game because it's just too hard and you're never as good as you'd like to be. Always be proud of yourself for what you can do, rather than be dismayed by what you can't do. Of course, push yourself, but only if you think what you're doing is reasonable and will help you out.

It's like that in school or work, too. You can probably excel at a few subjects (or at certain tasks), but not at every single thing you do, unless you happen to be that one kid who just seems to get straight A's without much effort or have tremendous physical ability. But in reality, being gifted at a few things is a true blessing, and you only really need a few passions (like guitaring, in your case) to have a happy and successful life in the end. Focusing on the few gifts you have will truly make you outstanding. Instead, if you tried to pursue all your weaknesses, you'd truly be wasting your time and energy for something that might not have been meant for you. No one would be satisfied with that kind of life. If this is how you feel you are going on with life at the moment, believing you can't do anything (especially things you're passionate about) well enough, or that you're just not good enough and never will be, perhaps you need to work on your self-image. Don't be afraid to seek counseling if you feel like that and want it to change! It'll be worth your while.

I hope my post made you feel better about yourself as a player, because for someone who's been played for a month, you're really damn good. I showed your video to a friend and he couldn't believe it, either.

Cheers!

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Just keep in mind some things:

- Is a game, enjoy it!
- If you want to masterize something, you need to dedicate a lot of time practicing it.

Now from the Simulated Dance side:

- Play a lot of different songs, some songs has unique tips to teach you.
- To get good timming try to play at slower speeds, 1x, 0.5x that will help you better than playing at 2x, 3x, etc.
- Play without the bar needs a lot of experience of reading charts, that's the main reason of playing a lot, if you know the arrow patterns, you could anticipate your movements and avoid to fall. Also playing with the bar needs more energy, you need to prepare better before to play.
- To train hardest songs you need to get some skills before, try to play the songs that you want in standard before try the heavy/expert difficulty.
- Playing nonstops/endless helps a lot due the fact of less time waiting for the next song.
- Play DDR and ITG mainly, taking the advantage of playing in a pc.
- Play hard, but take a rest too.

That's all from my experience. Just keep playing, and you will find in a near future that you've learned a lot.

What home games (if any) are these songs on?

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All of the above listed are playable on an American PlayStation 2, if you have one.

SUNKiSS♥DROP - DDR X US CS
No.13 - DDR SuperNOVA US CS
exotic ethnic - DDRMAX US CS
TOMORROW - DDR EXTREME2 US CS

Feel free to search RemyWiki if you want to find information about certain BEMANI songs, artists, etc.

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Also, just for extra reference, I normally practice 1 to 2 hours every day. Not sure if this is healthy or not... (I normally take breaks in-between every 3-5 songs or so)


Aaaand the only four DDR games I have now aren't ANY of those... (well, aside from 1)

(I have DDR Extreme, Extreme 2 but haven't unlocked the song, DDRMAX2, and SuperNOVA2)

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That doesn't sound bad, but you might want to give your body more regular breaks, so you could give yourself time to recover and build muscle memory... Maybe try 2-3 hour sessions 2-3 times a week?

As for the games you have, I'll see if I can find you songs to recommend.

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Thanks for the feedback! Freestyling sounds like a lot of fun, but where do I start with it? I'm completely useless at real-life dancing and I have absolutely no sense of how to actually dance or memorize charts.

I've also noticed that the arcade pads are different and because they're slightly lowered than the rest of the pad (i.e. the center is higher than the directional arrows). Is there anything I can do to help compensate for that?

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Keep playing at the arcade, that's pretty much it. There's certain pads your feet will be used to at any given point in time.

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Also... update time!

(aka you guys get to see me fail at charts that I've been playing for the first time)



I also apologize for the terrible audio quality, this was filmed with my mac laptop which has a horrible microphone for DDR.

Also.. crossovers. OH MY GOD CROSSOVERS.

MY GOD THEY ARE DIFFICULT.

(especially when it's down left down right up down etc.)

Will post a video of that sometime in the future.

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