Old player recently returned - DDR A has me leaving with mixed feelings...

Hello, first post since registering, and I feel this is a good forum to generate discussion about looking at how DDR has changed throughout the years.

I began playing on the first-ever mix back in '99 at the arcade when I was in high school, and played consistently up to DDR Extreme (JP) during college. At that point, other things happened, and DDR wasn't a priority anymore.

Fast-forward a good ten years, and I came across a DDR machine again, prior to DDR A. I played on and off again, and once DDR A was widespread, I began playing more regularly once again. The most important part is that it's still fun, more than ten years on.

However, there are some things that I really don't know how to process.

- Remote updating. Sounds good on paper, but seeing old licensed favorites disappear one day felt a little disheartening. Yes, I'm old.
- The game seems easier and harder at the same time. The first time I made a misstep and got a "good," I was surprised that the combo wasn't broken. Because I skipped Supernova, X and whatever other mixes were released between Extreme and A, I imagine this was a change made somewhere there. On the one hand, it's nice not to see a combo broken because of a misstep. On the other hand, I'm left thinking along the lines of "Aw man, a 'good' there would have cost me a life back in MAX2!" (referring to "Can't Stop Falling in Love Momo Mix," an Oni exclusive in DDRMAX2) Or how I'm not as fit anymore because I can't full-combo "Can't Stop Falling in Love Speed Mix" in Expert mode without any "Good"s.
- And the harder songs are just...wow. To think that "Paranoia" was the hardest song back in '98, and today...

On the flip side, there are new elements that I *DO* like compared to Extreme and pre-Extreme

- I love the idea of shock arrows. Definitely adds more spice to the gameplay. Again, I'm sure this isn't unique to DDR A.
- I really like the concept of e-Amusement and how you can keep track of your scores, unlock songs and what have you.

So it seems that Konami is implementing all sorts of features to keep arcade goers coming back. But a quick search shows that they've more or less given up on the home market, leaving fans to rely on third-party manufacturers for pads and StepMania for playing at home, unless you want to play older mixes.

Yeah, I'm old.

Yeah, you're old.

Also forgot to add - I've noticed sync-related glitches about twice where the steps just don't seem to correspond to the music.

I mean, I know that I'm not some world-class player, but songs like Burning Heat have Expert stepcharts which are more or less spot on with the music.

So much has changed within a decade, hasn't it?

In any case, I'm glad you're back on the DDR boat again. There's many features, styles, and visual changes and trends that came and went, it's hard to keep track when you're out of the loop.

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Do you use the bar?

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First off, since you're new here, welcome to the site!

A lot of stuff has changed since you last played DDR, hasn't it? I can only imagine some of the things running through your mind as you play DDR A. You must miss a lot of stuff, including old licenses, old judgment fonts, judgments in general, and yeah. The game just isn't the same anymore, and I know it can get really confusing for a veteran like yourself. But I'm glad to hear that after all this time you still find this game fun. You can never be too old for this game, really, as long as you still enjoy it. That's what matters, really!

Yes, Goods adding to your combo was implemented just three years ago upon the release of DDR 2013. Thanks to this, it's been considerably easier to clear songs on LIFE4. On DDR A, though, they've been readjusted that they even add a bit to your score now. It must be also tough to process everything that you were familiar with that has changed - new scoring system (SN2, modified in A), new difficulty scale (X), new announcer (X, with new lines in A), no more "Almost" judgments (X2), goods adding to combo (2013), different options available over various mixes, etc.

You're one of the few that actually love the idea of Shock Arrows! Yes, those were made back in DDR X and most players hated it then because of how poorly they were done at the time. We actually haven't seen any new Shock Arrow appear in over a year, so I don't know if they'll make a comeback anytime soon.

Hope you enjoy your stay here at Z-I-v. Feel free to have fun with us forum users!

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I am also old and also agree with 100% of what you posted.


1998-2003 was the golden era for Bemani for sure.

Why can't people adapt?
I played back then too but I still enjoy the new stuff

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I don't know. Probably something to do with the fact it was much better back then.

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That's an opinion
Not a fact

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Golden Era of DDR, maybe, (though most people's golden era was really DDR EXTREME) but virtually every other Bemani game's had it's best era later. Beatmania IIDX in particular says hi.

EDIT: Also, every person's favourite mix is different. Personally, my favorite is DDR A, but that's because I more or less play exclusively the Konami Originals, which don't get removed as often.

Also, on another point, another thing you should be aware of: Dancemania's dead. Entirely. Nothing's left.

Is it an "opinion" that DDR hasn't EVER been as popular as it was back in 1999-2002? That's "better" to me.

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I shouldn't argue about mostly opinion based matters, but I'll say this: if you released DDR EXTREME (and we're sticking with that because that's generally considered the pinnacle of old DDR) today, I don't think it would stack up as well. Yeah, we'd get Dancemania back, but really, what else would we get?

We'd lose a whole bunch of options (stuff like Screen Filter, which for many is helpful in watching arrows), our speed mods wouldn't have .25x increments anymore, bag would still be broken (12th notes are nice), and Marvelous timing would be restricted only to courses, meaning that the game would be "solved" much quicker - every song in EXTREME has been PFC'd. The only thing we'd get back I'd actually really like back is course mode.

Face it, the Golden Era of DDR was more lucky than anything else.

EDIT: Also bare in mind that Arcades in general are dying, so that would also hurt DDR's popularity.

It wasn't "lucky", it was "back then this thing was original but then we made twenty million versions of it after games like Dance Central and Just Dance and still expected them to do well". DDR was successful because there was nothing really like it at the time. At THIS time, there are.

EDIT: LET'S NOT TURN YET ANOTHER THREAD INTO THIS

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For me, I prefer older songs to newer songs. SN and SN2 had their version of ddr songs and I liked it as well. When X came, I started to care less about new songs. I haven't played Ace yet but I am making a trip soon to one and I am excited to try it out(If it works)

Back then, I was in the camp that tried to keep hands off the bar when possible, and to rely on it sparingly. Subsequently, I can't really play with the bar.

But I'm not trying to spark a debate about whether that's better or worse.


Oh, don't get me wrong, I don't hate DDR A. Granted, in my area, that's the only mix available, so I don't really have much of a choice in terms of mixes, but I'm fortunate that I have a machine 20 minutes away by foot or 5 minutes away by bus, and that the machine is in tip-top condition.

The thing that I don't like about online-enabled Bemani machines now is that Konami can remotely push and take away songs. Chances are that it is a licensing issue (like what happened with Dynamite Rave - the "new" lyrics totally threw me off the first time around), but still.

Also, I like enough of the new stuff on DDR A to enjoy every trip I make, so...

RemyWiki is a great source to see the changes between Extreme and A.
Also NAOKI left Konami along with Jun ;_;

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Yeah, that was a bummer for sure.

At the same time, I'm enjoying the music of the likes of Ryu.

Yeah, I totally understand that players can get emotional for not being able to play their favorite song once it's removed online (unlike through a new game, that would keep all the existing songs intact in that mix). I was honestly sad to see Kind Lady go; as much as I love the song, I haven't even had a chance to play the "new" Challenge chart they gave to it in DDR 2014.

On the flip side, being enabled online allows for surprises, adjustments and events on a regular basis! I bolded that last part to make it relevant; we're getting all this new stuff as we go! At the moment I'm very curious to see what Konami did to S!ck by Eagle (being released in a few hours) even though I live nowhere near one of these beautiful cabs.

Indeed, those two will be forever missed. I like Ryu☆'s music as well.

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Most of the changes you describe literally happened on DDR A for the first time